Jacinda Ardern joined Jonesy and Amanda on Gold 101.7 this morning ahead of the release of her memoir A Different Kind of Power, reflecting on her time as Prime Minister of New Zealand.
She spoke about discovering she was pregnant, the anger she still feels following the 2019 Christchurch mosque attacks and what she misses about her former role.
Amanda: You’re about to find out whether you’re going to be Prime Minister of New Zealand, and there’s a pregnancy test waiting to come to fruition on the bench. Those two things could not have collided in a more dramatic way for you.
Jacinda: That’s right. And I remember, Amanda, at the time that it happened, I just thought, you couldn’t write about this like this is just too much.
Amanda: How did you feel, obviously you wanted to be Prime Minister? You want to be a mum. Did you feel in that moment, I can make both work?
Jacinda: No, not at all. I mean, look, someone once said to me in politics, there’s no such thing as perfect timing. Like you just can’t get everything to line up for when it suits you and for when it suits life, and for when it suits your family. And that statement was never truer than in that moment. One of the things I wanted to do, and telling this story we share a little bit more about how this came to be, because I always worry that New Zealanders when I became Prime Minister [at the end of] 2017 and then 2018 I’m taking maternity leave. I always worried that they thought, what were you doing?
And by sharing this story, I can give a little more context that I’d been told I would struggle to have a baby. I wasn’t sure it was going to happen for me, and I carried a bit of sadness over that. And when I was running as leader, I just put it aside and decided that I would think about it later. But lo and behold, there was no avoiding the subject when that happened, when I found out I was pregnant during negotiations.
Jonesy: Being a Prime Minister, it’s one of those jobs I’d imagine where you just don’t know what your day is going to be like. And particularly with the 2019 shooting at the mosque, your life must have just matrix-style to slow down at that point.
Jacinda: It’s an interesting way to describe it, because there are moments that, amongst the chaos of crisis, do slow down. And I have this very distinct memory of during March 15, just my desire as soon as I heard about the attack was just to get on the ground, to be there. But at that time, they weren’t sure whether or not it was a wider attack, whether it was coordinated, whether there were other people involved, whether I was a target. So, I was bundled off to a police station and kept there for some time. And when I eventually got closer to where officials were to be briefed, as I walked into the office, one of my officials said to me, Prime Minister, this will define you. And I remember in that moment thinking, I can’t think about that, I can’t think about how people will see me as a result of this event. I just have to think about how I do my job when people are afraid.
Amanda: Your anger is still palpable on the page as to what that terrorist was trying to do to your country. And in that moment, you chose to just open your arms to everybody. You may be a new arrival in New Zealand, but you are us.
Jacinda: And I wonder if sharing that string of emotions, you know, finding out what had happened, that our community had been targeted, and then so soon after having the manifesto and knowing exactly what the intent of the attacker was and feeling so angry. And I remember the rage, just feeling so much anger about what his ambition was, and it was to try and create almost a war between our people and the idea that he wanted to achieve. I think New Zealanders as a whole just rejected that we weren’t going to be manipulated. In fact, we were going to hold closer the community he had targeted. So, I really credit New Zealanders in the midst of for that response.
Jonesy: What’s one of the cool things that you miss from about being Prime Minister? From the cars to the free stationary, green light corridor, you know, things like that.
Jacinda: It’s going to sound a bit trite, but I miss the great people I worked with. I mean, you could see something on the news and think, wow, look at that thing that amazing person is doing. I’d like to go and visit that. And you can. But you also get to solve problems. I mean, how many times have you been irritated by something in your life and then you’re going to have a chance to do something on behalf of people to fix problems. It’s an immensely privileged job to have. But there are things I don’t miss as well. I don’t miss the weight of it because it is a weight.
Jonesy and Amanda can be heard from 6am to 9am on Sydney’s GOLD 101.7, or on the free iHeart App.